Anthony Chene attended business school and began a career in finance before realizing that was not his life’s passion.

After graduating in media journalism and audiovisual production, Anthony worked as a video reporter within companies, media agencies, and TV channels.

Now, Anthony works as a freelancer (DOP, director, or video reporter) for various clients, and develops his own projects (documentaries, videoclips, fiction).

I learned about Anthony from watching his interviews on his YouTube channel. Anthony creates beautiful films of interviews with Near Death Experiences and documentaries that answer the deepest questions about life, who we are, and why we are here.

I coaxed Anthony to come out from behind the camera and the microphone and to sit in the hot seat so his fans could get to know something about the man behind these life-changing works of art.

Anthony is based in France, and travels on a regular basis for his productions.

 

 

Transcript

Brian Smith 0:00
Close your eyes and imagine what are the things in life that causes the greatest pain, the things that bring us grief, or challenges, challenges designed to help us grow to ultimately become what we were always meant to be. We feel like we’ve been buried. But what if, like a seed we’ve been planted, and having been planted, to grow to become a mighty tree. Now, open your eyes, open your eyes to this way of viewing life. Come with me as we explore your true, infinite, eternal nature. This is grief to growth. And I am your host, Brian Smith. Hey, everybody, this is Brian Smith back with another episode of grief to growth. And I’ve got with me today a guy I’m really really excited to talk to his name is Anthony Shen. And Anthony is a filmmaker who makes films basically about nd ease and about consciousness and who we are. And he’s really, really popular YouTube channel. I’ve been following Anthony’s work for a long time. And I’m excited to have him here today to get him out from behind the cameras in front of the camera. So we get to know a little bit more about Anthony and what makes him tick. And Anthony did go to business school before he became a filmmaker. After going to business school, he gradually worked in media journalism, and audio visual production. And he worked as a video reporter within companies, media agencies and TV channels. And now he works as a freelancer where he does he directs and does video reporting for various clients. And he also develops his own products, his projects that we’re going to talk about today, documentaries, video clips, and fiction. Anthony is based in France, but he does travel on a regular basis for his productions. You’ll find out the Anthony’s first language is not English, but he speaks English better than any of the nice big French anyway. So we’re going to have a good time here today. So if you do want to contact Anthony, I want to give you his website, and I’ll mention it again later. But it’s Anthony Shen, it’s a n t, h, o n y, ch, E and e.com. And with that, I want to welcome Anthony to grifter growth.

Anthony Chene 2:14
Hi, nice to be here. So yes, as you said, I’m French. So I hope my English will be good enough for the interview. I’m not used to have people interview me. So I hope it will be fine.

Brian Smith 2:31
Yeah, it’ll be great. We did a little pre interview and I’m sure it’s gonna be fine. I’m really excited to get your again, as I said earlier, I want your fans to get to know you a little bit and we’re going to talk about your work and all that kind of stuff. But before we do that, Tell, tell your fans something that they don’t know about what what would be like something that they would find unexpected about you. I don’t know.

Anthony Chene 2:56
Yeah, you already said like, I went to business school in France before I started to make videos as a as a job. So I never did any class in filmmaking. I just did a few classes in audio visual production. But so I learned pretty much everything myself, like the sound equipment, the lighting the camera stuff, you know. So yeah, that’s one thing. Yeah, to

Brian Smith 3:33
say your films are beautiful. There’s, there’s so well done. There’s so well put together the way that and I’m most familiar with your interviews, where you sit down people with ended, Andy’s just recently became aware of your documentaries, and your documentaries are really wonderful, too. So you’ve done a really great job of educating yourself.

Anthony Chene 3:54
Yeah, thank you, actually, when I watched this documentary, is this the old the older documentaries, kind of very critical of myself, you know, I, I think I always think I can do better. So I try to always find the details that I can improve. So

Brian Smith 4:14
yeah. So you you went to business school, and you’re working in the business world, and you weren’t really satisfied with that. So is that is that when you decided to get into filmmaking?

Anthony Chene 4:25
Yes, yes. So long story because it took me like, a few years to to make the transition from the financial, the business school and the financial world to the to what I’m doing now. So it was not very easy. But yes, I could not fit into this corporate world. So it was like a it was a failure for me. You know, I couldn’t do it. Like I had so many friends that were they were able to To have a career and as a financial analyst, or in so many jobs like that, and I couldn’t make it, you know, it was like, horrible for me. Yeah.

Brian Smith 5:11
So when you decided to get into filmmaking, do you think that was more of the artistic thing? Because you want to be creative? Or was it the spirituality?

Anthony Chene 5:21
No, at first, it was the creative side that I, I didn’t know the old the spiritual subjects I’m dealing with right now, I didn’t know these subjects. When I started as a filmmaker. First, I started to make videos for a few clients in, in France, in Paris, you know, just fine, try to find new, a few gigs has a colleague like jobs, to make money. And it was various for various companies for publishing companies. I did. So many small videos like that. And I had a YouTube channel about economic also about economics, sorry, about the financial crisis. So I did the same that I’m doing right now. But I was interviewing politicians, I was interviewing economists, about the financial crisis about the subprime financial problems that we had. And I got, like, Can I get bored with these subjects? Because you know, after a few videos, you always you’re always saying the same stuff, you know, it’s like, nothing is going is going in the right direction. It’s, there is a real estate bubble, a financial bubble, it’s going to explode someday, but it’s not. So it’s kind of boring after a few videos. So yeah. And that’s when I found the first videos about near death experiences. A few years, a few years ago, I was already like 27 or 28 years old, when I first heard heard about near death experiences.

Unknown Speaker 7:09
And

Anthony Chene 7:11
I was very, very curious about that, because I couldn’t make sense of what happened to these people. And so, yes,

Brian Smith 7:22
so I’m curious, what was your spirituality going into that I understand that you were interested? You were raised Catholic? Is that correct? Yes. Okay. And so what was your What? What was your spirituality when you first heard about these indies and had that line up with what you thought before?

Anthony Chene 7:40
I didn’t have any spirituality, basically, when I heard about these stories, because I am not, I don’t practice religion, you know, so it’s like, it’s, I didn’t have any spirituality. I don’t have any family. In this spiritual stuff, you know, I don’t have someone who is psychic or things like that. So it was very, very new for me. Okay, a whole new world open. Okay. And but I think that something resonated within me about this stuff, because I remember like, I also, I already said that in other interviews, but when I was a child, I, I had some some How can you say, some intuitions about the divine and things like that? So I think it’s like a, it was a, it was a part of me, you know?

Brian Smith 8:42
Yeah, I think that’s pretty common for us. I think as children, we kind of have this understanding of this knowing and then the adults teach us things, right. And they kind of that kind of goes away for a while.

Anthony Chene 8:54
Yes, I think the, the all everything I did in business school, it was not the real me, you know, it was just something I tried to become to fit in this, this world, you know, make a living and please your please your family and, you know, this kind of things, but it was not me. And what I discovered after I think it was the real, the real meat, in a sense. So it took me like 28 years to discover something about me, you know, it’s it’s kind of strange, but

Brian Smith 9:32
no, I think it’s very common. I think I think a lot of us go through that. So was there a particular event or something that triggered this this discovery?

Anthony Chene 9:42
Not really took me like, I remember it took me like I was 2728 It took me a few months. I was listening to a lot of interviews, I have read some books about near death experiences about about the Egyptian pyramids, also About the personal development subjects. And no, I didn’t have like a near death experience or a big awakening. But I did have some weird dreams, this period of time. Remember some dreams about people like it was a strange dreams about people telling me like that I had to do videos about these subjects. You know, it’s hard for me to explain that in English because it was a some kind of really weird dreams. It was not like a conscious thing. You know, I was not channeling anything, or I didn’t have during the day of big awakening. It was just during the night that I had this information coming. And I think it played a big part in this process, but I’m not conscious of it. You know, it’s,

Brian Smith 11:02
yeah, yeah. Well, a lot of people that have had nd ease tell us that at night, we visit with the other side, and we visit our loved ones and our higher selves. And so you think maybe that was your higher self or your guides saying you Anthony, it’s time to?

Anthony Chene 11:17
Yeah, yes. It’s always tricky to, at least for me, it’s hard to answer this question. Because I’m not a psychic. I’m not consciously psychic, you know, so I don’t really know, there is what we call the veil of forgetfulness in English, you know, so, so I really have a strong veil. Yeah, I don’t, I don’t really, it’s not, it’s not like I’m humble, or I play something I really don’t know. But I think there is a we all have a higher self, or maybe guardian angels or spiritual guides, as you say. And that, before we come into this world, we hope we all have a plan, you know, kind of a plan before and we have some checkpoints, I believe during your life, you know, at some point, you have to do some stuff. And if you’re not doing them, like for me, I was doing completely all the things that you have like maybe your higher self or spiritual guides, the wake you up, they give you some tips like you have to go back to your to your trail that

Brian Smith 12:31
Yeah, like like, it’s like a Yeah, like a course correction. It’s like, you’re you’re going along and you’re you just need a little nudge in the right direction.

Anthony Chene 12:39
Yes, but it’s very subtle, you know, right. Very, it’s, at least for me, it was very smooth. So you don’t, you don’t you don’t realize it, but I remember that I before that I was kind of depressed about but what was going on, like, professional in my own life and in the world in general? No, I was very depressed. So it’s kind of a feeling like you have to do something else in your life, but you don’t really know.

Brian Smith 13:11
Yeah, yeah, at first. No, I completely understand what you’re saying. And you’re right. And I think you’re it’s interesting as you’re you’re into this subject so much but I can still tell you a little bit skeptical and your your little your your intuition that you’re not speaking like Oh, yes, my guides came up and they told me that because I understand that feeling and you know, the dreams and waking up in the morning and having the aspiration

Anthony Chene 13:36
Yes, it’s Yes, it’s Yeah, it’s very interesting what you said it’s, I don’t feel I’m skeptical but I I just tried to be very accurate and, and honest about what I experienced, you know, yeah, I cannot tell people like yes, I can definitely know. My guardian angels are talking to me. I don’t really know for sure. But I I came to the conclusion that there was something guiding me because I couldn’t do my might myself I couldn’t do it alone. You know what I did like this American channel, this YouTube channel. Just today, it would have been too hard. I must have some help. Yeah, and that it’s like I have there are two parts in me like there is the regular hand Tony you know who is fearful and we just, I don’t get it most of the time. What I’m doing but there is a deeper part in me I can feel sometimes that is very confident about what is going on and I just on how can I say in English? It’s harder for me Sorry, but yeah. There is a deep Part of me that just no. Huh? Some sometimes you just know. Yeah, I can feel that sometimes.

Brian Smith 15:10
Yeah. That inner knowing that that Yes.

Anthony Chene 15:14
It’s not a belief just you know, I know what is going on? I I know what I’m supposed to do but at the same time on in my daily life, I don’t know. So it’s it’s really strange just have to show up in faith, I guess.

Brian Smith 15:31
Yeah, yeah I love how you put that and that’s that’s the thing I think about being human when the real challenges. Some people call it the small self and the bigger self, the ego and the higher self. So we have that that part of us that you know we’re walking around going like what is going on? But we can tap into that other part of us and says, Yeah, here’s what’s going on.

Anthony Chene 15:53
Yes, it’s all about, it’s always the same subject is Don’t, don’t be fearful. But it’s easier said than done, as you say in English. Yeah, very easy for me to say, okay, don’t be fearful and do this and do that. And but then you live your own life. And you are fearful.

Brian Smith 16:15
Yeah. So how did you? How did you get started with the the nd interviews? Who was Who was your first subject?

Anthony Chene 16:24
So at first I did that. I did these interviews in French. I had, I still have a French YouTube channel. Much which it’s bigger than in English, because it’s older. Yeah. So I did, I did a lot of people in French at first with Yeah, you don’t know them in France, but some are quite famous. area. And then I had a very strong intuition that kept coming back that I had to do it in English in the US, because I knew California from my business school. Because I had to do international internships, to validate my business school. And I happened to find an internship in the Bay Area in California, completely out of the blue. And so I so then I used to go on vacation and in California a lot and in the, in the American West. So a few years later, when I started to be a filmmaker in France, I had this strong intuition to to go back to the US and do these same kind of videos I was doing in French to do the same in English. Oh, wow. That’s the story. Well, and it was a nightmare. It was it was horrible. Because it’s I have like almost no money, you know, all the usual stuff when you begin. And I didn’t know anyone in the family in the US or under just started to make videos. And I got some help. One way or another. I had, I had some people helping me like finding near death experiences like bah, bah, bah, back to normal Loma. I can say it in English. was working was working for helping ions. You know the association. Yeah. Yes. So she helped me find some people and also people helped me to find some people and I started to build this, this channel in English. So that’s the story.

Brian Smith 18:42
Yeah. Well, I’m really glad you did.

Anthony Chene 18:44
Yeah. It’s, it’s like the trips were not very easy to make. Like, I used to spend like two weeks in the US, you know, they come back and I did the editing in France. And that’s how I started in English. Yes.

Brian Smith 18:59
Do you remember how your first subject was in English?

Anthony Chene 19:01
Yes, it was the documentary called beyond our sight. Okay. Yes, experiences and psychic medium called to psychic mediums one called Terry Yoder, and as another call the seven sample, as well as for his near death experiences in the story. And that was my first documentary that I did in San Francisco. And he, again, the conditions that I had to make this first documentary was like, when I when I look back at what I did, it’s like, how come I was able to go through the process is first like, no, it was a impossible one. So that’s when I really had to follow the trust and follow the guidance, the intuition. Yeah, it kept coming back like you Have to go back to go back to California. Go back to California, do this stuff do this. So where does it come from?

Brian Smith 20:09
Yeah. So when this was coming back, would you say this was a waking thought? Or was this more of a thing in that dream state again? No, it’s

Anthony Chene 20:18
like, it’s Yeah, it was in dreams. In my dreams, I had some powerful dreams about coming back. And also during the day, like the idea, and I had many synchronicities and many science about going back to the US. And sometimes I got, like, angry at the other side, even if I don’t hear them. And it’s like, I’d say, okay, you want me to do that? Look, I won’t do it. Because it’s too much. It’s just too much like, I won’t do it. Unless you help me. Then like, a few days, or a few weeks, after that, I got like, exactly what I needed to go back. And it’s it’s repeatedly like, Time after time.

Brian Smith 21:07
Yes. It’s an interesting how that happens. You know? Yeah, it’s

Anthony Chene 21:10
really strange. Even when I talk about it, I thinking it’s doesn’t make any sense.

Brian Smith 21:19
But the great thing about you sharing that, and about the work that you do with the nd ease is, then we realize that we’re not alone, because a lot of us have experienced that, you know, and they’re like, Is this my imagination? Am I just making this up? I’m talking to myself? Yes. And yes, it’s

Anthony Chene 21:36
a great question to ask like, yeah, yeah.

Brian Smith 21:41
So, you know, good for us, that you you trusted all that. So, um, so now, how do you choose your subjects for your, for your, for your films, because you’ve got so many, and there’s so many people to choose from? So just curious what that process is like.

Anthony Chene 22:00
There is no real process, I try to listen to a lot of videos. I read a lot of books, and I try to, to see what could be what could be done. But as you say, usually I have so many things that I can do. And the problem is like, how can I organize myself then to do the all the subjects that I want to do?

Brian Smith 22:27
Right, right?

Anthony Chene 22:28
Usually, it’s this kind of question the other way around, because I have many, many ideas and many subjects that I want to too many documentaries I’d like to make. So it’s it’s an ongoing process. It’s and sometimes it’s it’s really strange how it happens, you know, like, people come to me or receive emails, or I received propositions at the exact the very time that I need. Yeah, the thing. So you never know.

Brian Smith 23:13
Yeah, well, you know, it’s just yeah, I think about nobody asked you that question. That was that was that logical side of me, right? saying, Okay, how do you do this? And yes,

Anthony Chene 23:22
yes. And I have it to this logical side, because I used to, I’m a, I’m a kind of, I’m a very, very mental, you know, very, I want to understand everything, I want to ask questions, right? I always want to get, I want to understand everything, basically. So I’m, I’m like that, but I, I learned that you, I just cannot. I it’s very, like, it’s very strange, because the when I when I talk about myself, like it’s the thing I understand the least, you know, I process my own process. Like, the the famous question, or I always have this question is like, Why do you do these subjects? You know, why? Why are you doing all this? And it’s like, I don’t have any simple answer. No.

Brian Smith 24:18
Yeah. Well, you know, it’s interesting that we’re having this conversation because you talk about in your films, and I’ve seen it when you did another interview, I saw with you this, this idea of intuition versus knowing rationally. And and I can tell you’re really deep thinker and people like you and I, we wonder, well, how does this work? You know, what’s, what’s the logical basis for it? And having to trust that this intuition goes beyond that?

Anthony Chene 24:48
Yes, yes. Yes. It’s, yeah, exactly. I think the creative process like I think Must be the same for musicians or for creative people like it, there is some part of the process that you cannot grasp. Right. Record channeling and unconscious channeling? You know, it’s very weird.

Brian Smith 25:16
Yes, yes, I can I completely agree. And and you know, so that the end, would you say we’re talking earlier, we’re talking like teasing this thing out which part of this is me? And which part of this is some something else or something outside of myself? And the answer is we don’t really know. Right?

Anthony Chene 25:31
Yes, because I was. I’m always very afraid of making things up. When you say, I look like, skeptical, you know? Because I don’t want to make things up for myself. No, I don’t want to become someone like, I’m, you know, I don’t want to lie. I don’t want to lie to myself. Right? To be very honest, as honest as I could about what I do. And and so I know, I’m not a psychic, I’m not a medium. And I think there is a higher plan for every one of us. We just have to trust what’s happening. And but, yeah, that’s what I wanted to do.

Yeah. I’m curious, because you said that, I think there’s a higher plan for every one of us. Did you have that idea before you started studying in these? Or is that something that came to you after you started listening to the lessons from indies? It was after, I think, after when I started to discover these subjects about, let’s say about spirituality. I understood a lot of things about myself and about my own life. Until then, was it before that it just seemed chaotic and random, you know, I, I went to California, I did this and did that and came from this part of the world and, and after that, I realized that everything was here for a reason. Nothing was random. And nothing is random. Everything has, when we say everything is perfect. It’s not that like everything is nice and cool. But it’s everything has a deep reason. Everything happens for a reason. And we have to find out even when it’s painful, and part we have to find out the reason and the meaning behind all this, why are we going through this painful event or things like that? So yeah, yeah. I think our choices we have the freedom to, to react, is there in wisdom, love and with faith or with fear when something happens to us? Hmm. So yes, I forgot your question. Well, I want to ask you, because you, you, I was asking you about this philosophy, you have everything for a reason. I was asking, did that come from the Indies? Because I did want to ask you, with your with your studying of indies for as long as you have, what are the lessons that are? And what are the lessons you’ve taken from indies? What do you want people to get out of your films?

I think the first big obviously, the first thing is that we don’t die. Like as we think we die. It’s not the body dies, of course, but who we really are beyond the thoughts beyond the body and beyond the emotions, who we really are. doesn’t die. That’s the main message behind the nerdiest experiences, it’s like, death is nothing. It’s just in the blink of an eye. So you go through this 3d world and there is something else. And then there are many messages behind the near death experiences. I think it’s also it’s like, everything happens for a reason, as I said, and also that when you go on the life with you on the other side, you understand that your actions that had an impact on other people, what impact you had on other people, and you experience other people, feelings and thoughts towards you as if you were these people. That’s one less you know, like, at some level, you’re not just the person you will think you are. You’re just a whole scene. It will everyone is the whole scene at some level and when you’re on the other side You just get that. And you experience the whole scene, not just the you you think you are. Okay, so that’s another lesson and so many lessons, but it’s always at the end, it’s always like, don’t be fearful things like that you live your live your life and follow your intuition. And it’s very hard to follow your intuition in this world because it’s like a whisper. The intuition is very subtle. Mm hmm. And in this one, it’s very stressful. It’s very everything. So it’s very hard to follow this little voice, but that’s the, that’s the thing we have to do. Yeah, yeah, many things I could say about.

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Brian Smith 31:49
If people were to learn the lessons, if people were to watch your films and take the lessons from how do you think the world would be different?

Anthony Chene 32:00
It’s a very deep question. I have I have a lot of mixed feelings about this world right now. I don’t know about you, but it’s can we save this world? How can we improve this world?

Unknown Speaker 32:19
I don’t know.

Anthony Chene 32:23
I think people will, will. I think we should have more power on ourselves. You know, we should do not listen to everything you’ve been told. And listen to yourself more to your true self. Like the that’s the solution. That’s the key the keys within who you really are. That’s the real solution. Because the reality we experienced this 3d world is like it’s just a dream. In a sense, it’s relatively real. It’s just a projection from inside out. So if we want to change this world, we have to project something else. But not just on a conscious level, like let’s say a one a better world, but we have to really, on the subconscious level on an emotional level, we have to project something else, every single one of us. So it takes a lot of time to change the world because we have to people have to change themselves first. Yeah. So I think it will take time, but I think it is there is an acceleration going on right now.

Brian Smith 33:39
I’d say you do believe there’s an awakening going on people are are.

Anthony Chene 33:43
Yes, I think so. But But there are also many other things going on. So yeah, I don’t know. I tried to focus on what I can control and what and what I can do, because otherwise I can I like everyone else. I feel depressed. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Brian Smith 34:08
No, I understand. I guess I was asking the question that and I can in a fantasy way, if people if people could watch if we could if people could watch your films and awaken to the reality? Yeah,

Anthony Chene 34:21
yeah. I think it would be like the it’s a cliche, like a French word, but it’s like the end of the movie matrix. The one you know, hmm, if you really if I could awaken or everyone could awaken to, to to who we really are. It will be like the end of the movie like you when he says no, the bullets like they just stop. It’s really this kind of stuff. Like if you can awaken to who you are you you can project something else.

Brian Smith 34:58
Yeah, so let’s talk about that because I I know you mentioned a 3d world. And I’ve heard people talk about four D and five D, what does that mean to you?

Anthony Chene 35:07
Okay, so some hot questions. My understanding is that the 3d world is where we live right now in space and time, with the brain, the body and everything. Like we have to live in this 3d world. But that’s not it, there is more. And I think the 4d could be like the astral level. Like when we dream, when we go out of body. Some people can go out of out of body, it’s like another level of dimension, it’s right. It’s everything it at the same place, but it’s another vibration, you know, it’s a little higher. And when we dream, we can access this level and there is still a duality going on between good and evil. As we think you know, you can have a nightmare, you can have a good dream you can. When you go out of body, people often say that you can meet good entities or bad entities like demons or things like that. That’s the 40 plane. But you can go higher and higher, it’s not the end of it. So I think when you go beyond this astral level, when you can project your emotions very easily. When you go higher, you can. At some point, there is no duality going on, as we think like good and evil. Just one, everything is just one. And you just experienced that, but it’s beyond the words we can use. I think it’s beyond our understanding, you know, we are we are guys we want to, we want to understand everything. Right? Right. And we cannot get that like, there is no bad. And people will always say there is no bad things. Everything is perfect. Like, people will always say what about children dying? Hungry? What about murderers? All these kind of usual examples? And you don’t I don’t have an answer for why you don’t know, you just know that. This is not the end of it. What we are living right now, there is something more but it doesn’t mean that we have to escape this really well, because there is nowhere to escape is only here and now. So heaven and everything else haven’t died. It’s all here now. But we just cannot see it. Literally, we cannot see it. We don’t have we’re not conscious that it’s all here. And now. And that’s the job. We have to awaken. We have to remember. We have to remember who we are.

Brian Smith 37:47
Yeah. So do you. And this is another hard question, but I’m gonna throw out there. So what do you think the purposes of coming to this 3d world?

Anthony Chene 38:02
I don’t, the usual usual answer is to learn to run stuff, too. Because when you when we are in a body with thoughts and emotions, we can have a lot of experiences we can feel, feel different experiences that we can only feel here. But a lot of very often it’s like painful. And a lot of people like even especially right now, at this parallel period of time. There are a lot of suicides, a lot of depressed people. I know in France, I know it must be the same in the us right now. And the other part of the world that people just want out is want to like what’s the point of being here? Right? So but I think there is a point. And I think my honest answer would be like, at some point we are all every single one of us is God or the universe experiencing itself from a relative viewpoint. We’ve all heard the whole thing. Everyone is the whole thing experiencing itself from a fractal point.

Unknown Speaker 39:24
And

Anthony Chene 39:26
any time we have problems or questions about what’s going on in the world, or why am I here? I think the answer is to project something else to give to light your own to be your own light. And to project something. That’s the solution is the I think this is the solution.

Brian Smith 39:55
Yeah, I agree with you. And it’s interesting, you know, because that is always a tough question. Why are we here? Why does this exist? But you know, I think about the opposite. What if there were no evil? What if there were no pain? You know, life would be boring. You know? Imagine a movie, imagine a movie with no bad guy, where the good guy just he goes through his life every day, and nothing ever happens. Yes,

Anthony Chene 40:22
yes, maybe it’s here so that we are forced to do something were forced to evolve. Because it was the same in my life. In the beginning of the interview, I said, like about before I did this subjects. And when I was in finance, I was kind of not depressed, but not good about myself. No, like, what’s the point? And but thanks to the this kind of emotional suffering, I found other solutions other ways. I did this channel and I did a lot of things. But I don’t think that suffering is necessary. I think we, we should have other ways to evolve. Right? Right. You don’t we don’t have to suffer to evolve. But in this world, with our level of consciousness right now, it’s like, sometimes it’s the only way, you know, you have to suffer to get it.

Brian Smith 41:19
Yeah.

Anthony Chene 41:20
It’s horrible when you think about it, but we it’s because we are not wise enough. Sometimes, I think Yeah.

Brian Smith 41:27
Yeah. I’m sorry, to cut you up. But the duality gives us options. So you, we can come in this world, and we can focus on the world as you were doing when you were in Business School. Everybody says, This is what you should do. But you realize this is not satisfying me. This is not feeding my soul. There’s something there’s something more for me. So you’ve you’ve created this, this channel and this this great service, out of out of that realize that other thing was not for you.

Anthony Chene 41:58
Yes, basically, that’s what I did. Yes. But it’s, it’s not easy. Because on the one side, you can grasp something, you know, like, you will have a job, you will have money you will have friends, or parents or whatever, understanding what you’re doing. So you can grasp what you what you would have on this path. But on the other side, the intuition path, you don’t grasp anything. It’s like, I feel I have to go this way. But that’s it. Right? So you cannot even explain what you’re doing to other people around you. That’s why so many people when they change careers, or when they make another other plans in the life that they How can I say it in English, it’s Sorry, it’s hard for me in English sometimes to explain. A lot of people lose friends when they change plans, because you cannot explain what you’re doing what you have a deep intuition and you cannot explain it to other people. You’re left with your you are left with yourself.

Brian Smith 43:10
Right. Right. Well, it’s, it’s it goes back to that the 3d world. And I think for people like yourself, and people that have nd ease, they wake up to the reality that this world is not real. So the people that are stuck in 3d are chasing jobs and careers, and things that as you said, they’re tangible. They’re right here in front of us. But we know that they’re not real, that they don’t last.

Anthony Chene 43:35
Yes, yes, yes, yes. And it’s, yeah, for me, it’s one way I try to tell myself this story. Like, it’s good way to feel good about myself, because it’s what I experience on a daily basis. But sometimes it’s just, it was just, like a failure for me, you know, I cannot fit into this world. You know, it’s like you see a video game. It’s like a soul video game of people have cars on the, on the freeways and buildings and all this kind of stuff. And I said that I said to myself, there’s something I don’t get about this world. Like, how can how can I fit into this world? Why? Why does it feel that I am the only one that doesn’t fit into this world? And I’m not the only one I know. But that’s how it feels like it seems it feels like it. It’s, it’s not a good feeling. Hmm.

Brian Smith 44:37
Well, I heard your interview with Lee wedding. And you mentioned the fact when you were a little kid, you had this feeling of like a purple thing in your chest, I think was the way you described it. Yeah, that that connection and that. And when I was a child, I didn’t fit into the world either. And I would lie awake at night and say what is wrong with me or what is wrong with the world, that this doesn’t make any sense to me I was a kid during the Vietnam War. And I remember I watched on television every night people killing each other, and they would show the body count. And I thought, what kind of world? Is it when people go out and try to kill strangers? It’s just it never made sense to me. Yes, it’s that kind of feeling. Yes. Yes. So I understand what you’re saying. And I appreciate you. And I think that the thing I love about Andy are sharing this with us and you sharing it with us through them, sharing it through you, as it makes some of us not feel so alone. And we realized that there is something wrong with this world, there’s

Anthony Chene 45:34
something off? Yes, because I think right now, a lot of people are trying to fit into their life or their jobs or any, they, because they feel alone as a way. And, and you’re very, it’s not just about the lack of money, because you can always find a way to make money. Like, I say that, but I used to have a lot of fears about money. So it’s not an easy thing. But you, I always, I can always find a way to make money. But the hardest thing for me was not to feel alone in my job. Or in my, in what I’m doing. alone. I mean, not alone, literally in my life, but like, like, Am I right to do this? You know, is it? Is it? Is it complete? Nonsense. Does it make any sense?

Brian Smith 46:32
You want to have some sense of purpose, you know, and I was watching the film earlier, your film, who we are. And I think it was dean Raiden was talking about, you know, I know a lot of very wealthy people that aren’t very happy. And I think one of the problems with this world is once we get that wealth, and we think this is the thing, and then that doesn’t make us happy, then we’re even more depressed. Yes, we’ve realized that’s not the thing.

Anthony Chene 47:01
Yes. And yes, there is nothing wrong about having a very big house or several big houses and a lot of millions of euros or dollars in the bank account. It’s it’s a very nice thing to have. That it won’t, it won’t. It won’t bring us what we think it will.

Brian Smith 47:28
Right. Right. Bring us any meaning. Right. Yeah, exactly. So what I wanted to kind of shift gears a little bit. So I know you live you live in France, mostly? How are your films received in France? Or this this idea of spirituality? We? How does that go over there?

Anthony Chene 47:47
In France, it’s a little different than in the US. The general population is divided, like some people are awakening to these subjects. Some are not. But it’s but on average, and I have a lot of people interested in this subject in France. But the on the official level, like how can I say like the magazines, the TV Understand? Yeah. Oh, and so on, they hardly never share this kind of subjects. Mm hmm. There is no like Gaia, you know, gaia.com. And in the US, you have this website. We don’t have these. We don’t really have these kind of organizations in France. Yeah. It’s almost forbidden by the state. It’s kind of that’s a good thing to do in France.

Brian Smith 48:49
Yeah, it’s, it’s still, it’s still considered kind of fringe here in the US. I think there’s more, you know, the internet has helped a lot, you know, channels like yours, where it’s, it’s the democratization, right? We don’t have to get permission to put it out. You can? Yes, yes. It’s a little more open in the US. Yes. Right. And you can put an ideal, and I got to tell people, I mean, your films, you know, some of them have millions of views, and your interview is getting, you know, 10s of 1000s of hits. So there is there’s a real appetite for this that people you know, you mentioned earlier, you know, as we’re going through this two things we’re going through we talked right before, but we’re not going to get political but, you know, going through COVID and everything people are realizing this world is not making them happy. It’s not satisfying them.

Anthony Chene 49:40
Yes. And I wonder if it’s that the message we handle all this, behind all the things we’re living right now as a society, maybe it’s like, we have to get something and we have to get it soon. Like we have to get some And if we don’t, I mean, collectively, some not very good things happen and are going to happen, because it’s like, it’s not the choice anymore. We have to evolve now. Right?

Brian Smith 50:17
Right. We seem to and we, you know, it’s interesting, we talked about this earlier that sometimes people grow through suffering, and you’re saying you would be great if we didn’t have to. But as mankind, it seems like we need to hit a point of crisis, sometimes before we wake up.

Anthony Chene 50:33
Yes. And French spiritual teacher used to say, you don’t have to get a slap in the face every morning to evolve, you know, you can just get it without suffering. It doesn’t have to be that painful. Or you can just, it’s like, when you learn something, a new skill, you don’t have to suffer a lot. Every time you learn something. Sometimes you have to, but it’s not the it’s not. Not all the time. But in the Catholic religion, you know, I was brought Catholic. It’s a it’s a very deep belief, unconscious belief that we have in France, I think it’s like we have to suffer to this to deserve something. Hmm. It’s a it’s an unconscious belief that we have, like, if you don’t suffer, you have to show that you suffer that you that it’s hard, so that you can deserve something.

Brian Smith 51:40
Yeah, that’s a really good point. Because one of the lessons of the end, I think, is we make life way too hard.

Anthony Chene 51:46
Yes, Yes, I think so. Yeah, I think it’s truth. And yes, it’s very simple. The concepts are always very simple. And then it’s the application on the day, the life that is not very, not very easy. But it’s very simple. It’s like, follow your own intuition. And don’t be fearful. Don’t blame. Don’t spend your time blaming other people all the time and judging people, because very often, we think that our problems they come from, like other people around us. And it can be true on some level, but in the end, it’s just all about what we do. Yeah, what we project. Yeah. So we just, we, we lose time when we blame other people. And I blame Of course, when I say that, in my daily life, of course, I blame other people, you know, of course I am. Of course, I’m judging things. Of course, I’m fearful. So it’s, I don’t, I don’t want to like appear like, there is a difference between what i what i say right now and what I’m leaving. So just to be clear, I have to learn.

Brian Smith 53:11
Yeah, we all we all have that. So I guess my next question. So what do you do to enhance that inner knowing that intuition and to learn to trust it more and live from that?

Anthony Chene 53:24
I think the what I do like my videos for me, it’s, for me, it’s the best way to, to understand new solutions and new things. It’s, yeah, I found this way to evolve. When I made these videos, I learned new things. Every time I meet new people, I have new insights. So it’s a great way for me to to evolve. And I’m kind of like the, like the ocean also, you know, the, the waves the sea. So when I’m, when I’m just in front of the her, just put you just put me like one or two hours peacefully in front of the sea, and I get the messages very easily. You know what I have to do? flow is very easy after that for me.

Brian Smith 54:27
Yeah, we just arrived simple. There reminds me something that the john Butler said in your film, who we are is about, like, you know, we can’t really stop the thoughts, but it’s reaching that state where we can slow the thoughts down and whatever it takes to get us there. And so, yeah,

Anthony Chene 54:44
for Western people, yes. For for people like us. Yes. It’s a great way. I think people in India and Asian people in general, it’s maybe easier for them to meditate. And for us People in the West, we have a lot of thoughts. So it’s harder, at least for me. I know it’s very hard because I want to I want to think about everything, you know, I want to, to be rational about everything so. So a great way maybe it’s also to walk. No Western people, we have to walk in nature Walker, things like that. Because when we sit and we do not think, for a lot of people, it’s very hard not to think and not to have compulsive thoughts. Right,

Brian Smith 55:39
right. Yeah, we’re socialized that way. We’re, and we’re told, we’re told you should always be busy, you should always be doing something. And I’ve talked to many people about meditation over the years, and they’re like, I don’t I don’t have time. I can’t just sit for five minutes and do and do nothing.

Anthony Chene 55:54
Yeah, it’s a lie. But yes, that’s what we tell ourselves. Yes. Yeah. Because when, when we check what we do every day, like, usually, we had a lot of times where we just waste our time, we don’t do anything worth doing. You know, you say, I don’t have time. I’m so busy. But it’s not true.

Brian Smith 56:19
Yeah. So what are your What are your future plans? Are you planning to continue doing what you’re doing? What are some projects you have coming up?

Anthony Chene 56:26
Yes, I like to make bigger and bigger projects in the future English, like, I want my documentaries and films I do to be more and more professional, more and more impactful, more and more deep. Yes, that’s basically what I want to do. I’d like to work with other people as well, you know, like technicians and like, have very talented people. Like, also musicians, musicians, was the soundtracks. So that’s what I want. That’s the direction I’d like to take.

Brian Smith 57:13
So you’re doing are you doing everything on your own? Now? You’re doing all your production on your own?

Anthony Chene 57:18
Yes, but less and less, because the last interviews you saw on my YouTube channel, like the last three or four interviews, I wasn’t the one shooting the video. Okay, because I’m not I was not able to go to the US or right to other countries because of the crisis. This crisis. So I had people I paid people in the US to fill the interview, and I asked the I asked the question, through the questions through FaceTime through Oh, yeah. Yeah, in real time. So I have people’s filming for me, and also the music’s, but yes, I’d like to delegate maybe more in the future. Yeah. And of course, it takes more money. But I’ll find a way.

Brian Smith 58:13
Yeah. Yeah. Well, Anthony, I gotta tell you, this has been a real thrill for me, getting to know you. And I thank you for stepping out from behind the camera. And I saw get to see you and hear you. I know that that people are going to be so excited. I want to tell people I don’t you tell people where can people find out more about you? yet.

Anthony Chene 58:37
You think you told it like my website and Tony chen.com or my YouTube channel, you can find me very easily on YouTube and Tony Chen production. It was really good interview for me. But what I found is that it’s very, it’s harder for me to talk about why I’m doing what I do and my own life than talking about the other side. Sure, never been I’ve never had any any near death experience. But it’s much easier for me to deal with near death experiences, then to talk about my own my own life, you know, it’s very strange and very comfortable talking about why I do what I do. You know, I don’t have all the answers. And as a rational guy, it’s, you know, I’d like to be more accurate about what I do.

Brian Smith 59:33
Yeah. Well, the thing is, you know, we all have a role to play, you know, and and you haven’t had an MD I haven’t had an MD he and I interview engineers every day, but that’s my role is to get to bring their story out and get their story people and people want to know you are you’re very inspirational story. You’re you’re a guy who said I am on the path that I don’t really want to be on. This is not fulfilling me. I’m going to take this different path. And it’s it’s, it’s you’re gonna inspire other people to follow their dreams. So that’s why I wanted to bring your story out.

Anthony Chene 1:00:07
Yes. And just people, I know that a lot of people I personally know some people right now. They just want to change their life, their job or anything. And just, just don’t be fearful. And it’s going just know it’s going to be hard, right? But don’t be fearful and you will have a lot of health and we didn’t talk a lot about praying or stuff like that. But I think you can just ask things you won’t receive anything you asked for, like most people will ask for a million dollars. That, of course, is the basic thing to ask for. we all we all want peace in the world. But when we if you have one wish you will not wish for the peace in the world wish for a lot of money. Yeah,

Brian Smith 1:00:58
yeah. That’s a great welcome mission. We did. You did talk about prayer, though, earlier, because you said when your guides were telling you to do this, or this, you said I’ll do it if I get help. And then you got the help. Yes. And said you have to do? Yeah, yeah. Then you have to do so. There’s that challenge.

Anthony Chene 1:01:16
So yeah, I tried to ask a, because it’s so easy. You know, as a rational guy, it’s too easy. You know, like, just ask with your heart. just too easy for me. Like, if it was that easy. Why is so much suffering in the world and all these questions, but I think it’s that easy. You have to ask, you have to visualize. You have to be true to yourself. And just the doors will open.

Brian Smith 1:01:47
Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Well, we’ve seen it in your life and appreciate you. appreciate what you’re doing. You’re you’re you’re very humble guy. You’re very you’re it’s been great getting night.

Anthony Chene 1:02:04
Yeah. And you too, like you make people very comfortable, you know, because it’s, it was like a stressful thing for me to do this interview, you know, to, to talk in English to. It’s not an easy thing, but you. You made it like, good, so

Brian Smith 1:02:23
great. Well, great. It’s been fantastic getting to know you and I will talk to you soon. Okay, thank you. Have a good day. Okay, so that does it for another episode of grief to growth. I sure hope you enjoyed it. If you like this content, make sure you subscribe. So click on the subscribe button here, and then click on the bell to receive notifications and click on all that way you’ll be notified whenever I release new content. Thanks for watching, and have a great day.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

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