Grief 2 Growth Podcast- Dr. Mark Pitstick- The Greater Reality- Ep. 87

My long time friend, Dr. Mark Pitstick, and I had a wide-ranging chat on the nature of reality, the purpose of life, what awaits us after our physical body dies, and new develops in the field of technology, in particular, the SoulPhone, that will provide “proof” that we continue after our physical body ceases to function.

Mark Pitstick, MA, DC, has over forty-seven years’ experience and training in hospitals, pastoral counseling settings, mental health centers, and private practice. His training includes a premedical degree, graduate theology/pastoral counseling studies, master’s in clinical psychology, and a doctorate in chiropractic health care. He also has provided suicide prevention counseling and education to many people.

Mark became aware of clairaudient experiences at age ten and has since been blessed with numerous miracles, revelatory, and spiritually transformative experiences. After working in hospitals with many suffering and dying adults and children, he was motivated to find sensible, evidence-based answers to the questions that many people ask: “Who am I? Why am I here? What happens after I die? Will I see my departed loved ones again? Is there a God? If so, why is there so much suffering? and How can I best live during this brief earthly experience?”

Mark has written numerous books. On his website, you will find documentary films, CDs, and experiential workshops that address all of these questions and help you survive and even thrive through life’s biggest changes and challenges. Further, his work helps you discover how to enjoy the greatest life you have envisioned—no matter what your current circumstances.

Mark is also the Director of the SoulPhone Foundation.

You can find Mark at: ℹ️




Announcer 0:00
Hi there. Welcome to grief to growth podcast. Your host is Brian Smith, spiritual seeker, best selling author, grief survivor and life coach. Ryan believes that the worst tragedies of life provide the greatest opportunity for growth. Brian says he was planted, not buried, and he is here to help you grow where you’ve been planted by the difficulties in life. In each episode, Brian and his guests will share what has helped them to survive and thrive. It is his sincere hope this episode helps you today.

Brian Smith 0:35
Hey, everybody, this is Brian Smith back with another episode of grief to growth and today I’ve got with me Dr. Mark pet stick who’s actually a really good friend of mine. I’m going to read Mark’s introduction, a short introduction. He’s got a very long, very long resume already short introduction, then we’ll have a conversation. Mark Pitts tick has over 47 years experience and training in hospitals, pastoral counseling settings, mental health centers and private practices. training includes a pre medical degree, graduate theology, pastoral counseling studies, master’s in clinical psychology, and doctorate in chiropractic healthcare. Mark has also provided suicide prevention, counseling and education to many people. After working in hospitals with many suffering and dying adults and children, Mark was motivated to find sensible evidence based answers to the questions that many people asked. Just a little things like Who am I? Why am I here? What happens after I die? though? I see that my departed loved ones again. Is there a god? If so, why is there so much suffering? And how can I best love during this brief earthly experience? Mark has written many books documentary as produced documentary films, CDs, experiential workshops, that address all these questions and help you survive and thrive through life’s biggest changes and challenges. And you can find a lot more about mark at soul proof comm where there’s there’s some of that information. So Mark, welcome to grief to growth.

Mark Pitstick 1:55
So now I know Brian

Brian Smith 1:57
Yeah, I just said you know, try to go through your resume and through your entire background. you’ve, you’ve done so much. You’ve seen somebody, you know, you read, you’ve just made a great contribution. So where does it kind of start? Where did this this drive for you to explore the big questions of life? Where did that start?

Mark Pitstick 2:15
I think as part of my soul’s mission, my parents tell me that when I was six years old, they were showing me a beautiful sunset. And I told him, it reminded me of God. Now, we went to Lutheran Church, it was always God, the Father this and that, you know, they’re big paintings. He’s a white guy with long hair and beard sitting on a throne. So they were perplexed as to why would equate creator with the beautiful sunset. They only told me that, by the way, 20 years later, when I was in theology school, and there were a couple other events where people who could read auras or see energy or like oh my god, you know, I’ve only seen two of you in my whole life and they were in their 70s. And they said, You are Blue printer you are teaching so you’re the kind of soul that really comes to earth. And now I can see why. And, and you came here with big missions. And I said, Yeah, I mean I eat, drink and sleep it when I was a kid. It’s like I had to learn how to fit in how to be a normal Earthling. Because earthly way seems strange to me when I saw the Robert Heinlein book, Stranger in a Strange Land, like, that’s my life story. Yeah. So when I was 19, a couple things happen. First of all, I learned about yoga and meditation. And secondly, I started working in hospitals and pretty quickly got to the point where as doing almost all ICU, and er work cardiopulmonary resuscitation, breathing tube down the lungs, arterial blood gas punctures, pretty heavy stuff for 19, then 20 year old, almost every shift, I would be with one or more people who would, who died and seeing that, especially in the first time But with I had a pediatric ward, seeing little kids, you know, killed in accidents or sometimes abused. It just drove me to my knees and everything I’ve been taught, you know, God, God is all loving, all knowing all powerful, does sound like a whole bunch of BS. But it was a wonderful thing launched me on decades of searching. And now I feel like I have great answers, in many cases, evidence based answers to all the questions you posed in the intro.

Brian Smith 4:33
Yeah, it’s interesting because a lot of times when people find themselves in situations like that, it drives them the other way drives them to to materialism or atheism, where they say, well, there can’t be any meaning or purpose, because I see all this suffering. I think that’s kind of the easy, quick answer if that wasn’t satisfactory to you.

Mark Pitstick 4:50
Yeah, it’s kind of like we say in helping parents heal, you know, when something horrible happens, it can make you better or better. And in my case, I was a I call myself an agnostic, agnostic, because I really didn’t know. And that’s one reason I went to theology school instead of medical school because I wanted to find out for myself. What was the biblical history? You know, what was the early words behind some of these teachings? That didn’t make sense? You know, you shall fear the Lord that God and you got a loving guide who would let you or send you a fire eternal hell forever. Yep. Obvious discrepancies that most kids spotted and so that it makes sense. Yeah. So I searched and I actually kept cardboard boxes, everything I would read, think of here on the radio and so on. And finally, I had several big boxes of notes. And I thought I have a book here and that’s when I wrote the first book. So proof in the late 1990s.

Brian Smith 5:51
So it’s interesting. Also, you mentioned theology school, because I’ve heard for a lot of people that go to theology school, that’s what kicks off atheism for them. They become pastors, but they don’t really believe it. Yeah.

Mark Pitstick 6:03
Well, I would say and the men most that I’ve spoken to, they believe in a different kind of God here, they reject that day of steak primitive 2000 plus years ago image and see a more creative loving force energy. But how do most people without a background for understanding that? How do most people understand that they usually don’t have a support system for that? So they just know they reject the archaic images that don’t make sense.

Brian Smith 6:38
Yeah, you know, that’s, that’s really interesting thing as you were saying, I’m thinking about, but they’re still teaching it every Sunday, you know, for the most part, a lot of them are still teaching this guy that they really don’t believe. And frankly, it’s a very primitive view of God. It’s a very primary view. And, you know, as you were saying, how you felt growing up, that’s how I felt I was like, this world doesn’t make any sense to me and when I went I realized I was a separate being that didn’t make any sense to me. When I realized this guy was so angry, you know, why did why is he so mad at me? And you know, eternal hell? They’re like, Well, you know, you deserve eternal punishment just because of the fact you were born What do you know that I’d never understood that?

Mark Pitstick 7:19
Yeah, yeah Original Sin that’s another I’m gonna just like what I was blessed with Claire some clairaudient experiences I couldn’t make a living on it. But starting with a brown he ate, I became aware of voices in the first one was I was sitting with my family. My dad was the president of church Council. And we were very, very involved in the church. And the ministers talking about hell in the context of a fire eternal place at torment. For people who don’t believe a certain way or don’t do certain things. And this wise quiet voice that I’ve come to equate with the voice of God or spirit, I don’t see a disconnect between those two sets. Mark, they have that one a little mixed up. God has no need of such a place in his plan of salvation for all. So I turned to look at my mom and dad to see what they thought about that voice assuming that everyone in the church heard it. And they’re all just looking straight ahead, the Minister I was like, Okay, what just happened? Yeah, but I was cool enough to know to keep it inside. And then other similar teachings about the nature of heaven and everyone and having a high purpose and so on. So those formed teaching points have been trying to share with others and also trying to internalize you know, they say you teach most what you need to learn. So it’s been a lot of fun and we live in a, you mentioned the ministers, sharing just kind of what they’re taught. That was another one my insight. I thought, he’s just teaching. What he learned is like passed down and The nice thing is now 2020 we have so much contemporary evidence, scientific, clinical and a wealth of first hand experience evidence that gives us better notions and evidence, space notions for the nature of God, the nature of life, etc.

Brian Smith 9:19
Yeah, yeah, I think that makes perfect sense. And you are you’re fortunate are graced, I guess, to have that early, direct experience. For myself, that was a long traumatic journey, you know, out of that to where I am now. So you you. So let’s talk about some of these questions, some of these deep questions that you answer on your website, like, Who am I? Why am I here? So what’s your What are your thoughts on that?

Mark Pitstick 9:43
Yeah, short answers. First of all, we’re all we’re all beings of energy, consciousness, spirit, awareness. Those are different terms. I’ve learned so much from Dr. Gary Schwartz, as you know, former Harvard professor 10 dl professor, PhD in psycho psycho physiology now at University of Arizona doing the soul phone project research, he, he considers that we are beings of energy and information he calls it info energy. And from a quantum physics point from a systems theory point, you know people like Ervin Laszlo and him and others understand that everything that ever was or ever will be is stored in the zero point field, the quantum field. Hindu wise people 3000 years ago called it the Akashic field. And so that’s there and so that’s what we really are David boom, who’s gonna be a team members to the cell phone project, and was a close colleague with Einstein Einstein called him his spiritual brother. He was also boom Dr. David bone Bo Hmm, a mentor with the Dalai Lama who called him his science. cific teacher and a close friends with Krishna Murty, a prominent Hindu teacher. Well, he merged Hindu mysticism understandings with higher mathematics and quantum physics and he said that life is like a sea of energy. And periodically and that’s God, okay? Or that’s all it is whatever you want to call it. And periodically there’ll be a ripple of excitation on this sea of energy. Now depending on the observers point, that can look just like another while a great experience or it can look like for humans, most humans Oh my God, that’s horrible. You know, I’m looking at beautiful Shane it behind you. And I know it’s so tough, but the human reaction is, oh my god, my daughter died when in fact, nobody really dies. You are a soul mate. You are beings of energy. And what ROM das called the only dance There is this dance of energy, love life unfolding a series of adventures. So that’s who we are.

Brian Smith 12:08
Yeah, but that’s, that’s a great answer. I think that’s a and it’s interesting cuz I’m actually reading a book by a guy right now named Bernardo kastrup. And I’ve been trying to get him on my show, and I finally have him. So hopefully that’ll actually come off. And he talks about a philosophy called idealism, which as I’m listening to it, as I’m starting to understand, it sounds a whole lot like Hinduism. You know, the zero point field sounds a lot like Brahman, this concept of the potentiality that we in the in the West called no God, the source of everything that that is the is the what we all rise out of, and we’re all part of. So it’s really interesting.

Mark Pitstick 12:48
It’s fascinating and the more we understand about it, and the more we are free, I’m convinced that great teachers like Jesus and others, were teaching this very thing, but then the powers that be took hold of turn into a fearful controlling mechanism to win money from people and control them. So, you know, when he’s, there’s something called the Jefferson Bible and Thomas Jefferson had just the words that Jesus taken out. And that occurred to me when I was young. As I can know a lot of this that makes sense. But then when I read the words attributed Jesus, they make more sense. So he said, You shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free. Things like we don’t really die. And I am the father one and so were you. Follow the golden rule and so on. Just really basic. But one of the things I like to add about who we are, there’s also the concept of multilocation. Some people may be familiar with it, too by location or parallel realities, simultaneous realities, and there’s some good evidence for it first became aware of it through Native American teachings. My dear friends are Native American teachers and oh my God, what a wealth of wisdom those people had had. We only honored it and learn from it instead of casting them out. Anyway. I saw paintings in profile of a brave, and then above the brave, a bear, and then an eagle, and then tree and star and moon, and then the cosmos. And that was their way of teaching that we’re not just this physical being like the brave. We’re all of that we can experience life. We’re all interconnected and so on. So then you have people like Michael Newton, PhD, founder of life between lives therapy, and he and his team have done I think 50,000 now different cases, deep hypnotic sessions with people as they have a chance to remember their time before they came to earth. You People from all over the world they certainly didn’t get together and, and correlate this and make up stories and their descriptions of life before live life between lives is very, very similar. Well, one of the reports is that on average, only 25% or so, of a person’s energy consciousness being so whatever you want, is needed to manifest in this time and place. The rest can be experiencing life through in different ways, formed or formless and part of it may never leave home. And so in that sense, we are always with God, we are always together. That’s one of the things I share. When I counsel, bereaved parents, I say, if you can wrap your head around it, at the same time you’re grieving, and I know it’s horribly difficult, but it can lightness some to consider and again, good evidence behind it, that you and your child might be together right now. And just very real sense as you were together before here, his or her body died, right? And you’re looking down at this and wow, you know, mom’s sure having a tough time with this. I hope she remembers, because we plan this beautiful adventure, that she can have a breakthrough move from a brief prayer to showing light parents, it’ll bless so many people and it’ll teach her lessons that serve her for forever. So that’s, that’s how far out who we are is.

Brian Smith 16:29
Yeah, that’s, you know, as we were going through that I was just interested me how faith you know, we’ll call faith, religion revealed philosophy, whatever you call revealed knowledge, how that’s starting to emerge, I think with what science is telling us Oh, and I look at scientists starting to finally catch up right. So these mystics have known this for a very long time we know it intuitively in our souls. And it comes up to her throat intellect and we tell it in stories and stuff, but this our with our Western mentality They are materialistic mentality. We’ve said, Well, no, that can’t possibly be true. And now we’re finally getting the tools to find out. Yeah, this stuff is actually really true.

Mark Pitstick 17:10
Yeah, I encourage people to look at the contemporary evidence. And I share a lot of that my book so approved, actually shortened. I also did in our book, greater reality living, to look at the, what Aldous Huxley called the perennial philosophy, the golden threads that run through all the major religions, some of which I just mentioned, and then also true trust their inner experiences, their inner voice, and I think the combination of all that, and you’ve got a pretty good grasp of the nature of reality.

Brian Smith 17:43
Yeah, we’re reminded I was talking with a friend the other day, who’s, I would say, agnostic, but more leaning towards materialistic and we were talking about death and she said, I fear not existing anymore. And I said, You know, I was telling I bored with Kelvin Chen Chen a little bit. And he wrote a book about overcoming the fear of death and the first belief system, he calls us, when we fear we’re not going to exist. But I said there well, it doesn’t logically make sense to fear that you’re not going to exist. Because if you don’t exist, you won’t be there to experience a non existence. But I think something intuitively tells us that we are eternal. And we and we and so when we, when we feel non existent, we actually fear is like being in a void, we think we’re going to die and not have any experience. I don’t think we can even imagine that existing.

Mark Pitstick 18:32
Well, we now know for your viewers, without a doubt that conscience is survives after violate that it’s not a question anymore. And so that’s just part of what we’re sharing. And we’ll be able to make that statement even more strongly and say, scientific proof in six months from now. So it’s a wonderful time to be alive. And I hope people use that information to to be free. To relax to enjoy life. There’s one other angle on that. So you know the concept that we create our own realities by our predominant thoughts, words and deeds. So people who believe that there’s nothing and have a certain fear of death, it’s going to affect them now. And perhaps when they pass on, that will be their reality for a short time. There’s some evidence that a person’s belief carries over at least initially. So they’d be like, Okay, well, I’m dead, and there’s nothing there’s nothing because there’s nothing after you die. And then wait a minute, who’s who’s thinking? Who’s talking? What’s that light over there? So it’s a lot of fun.

Brian Smith 19:43
Yeah, well, yes. I’ve heard people having their death experiences that do experience what they call nothing for a short period of time that you said then they just kind of come to the thought well, then if there’s nothing Then who’s thinking this? Yeah. But yeah, it’s you know, as we learn these things, you know, we can we can We can kind of chuckle about them. But it’s a real. It’s a real dilemma for a lot of people. It’s a real fear. And I’ve had so many people say to me, you believe all this stuff, there’s no evidence for it. There’s no evidence for mediumship there’s no evidence that we survive after we die. So what would you say to someone that says to you mark,

Mark Pitstick 20:16
why we just kindly say they’re not informed. And I won’t use the ignorant word, I would just say nicely, they haven’t taken the time or perhaps they don’t know where to get get informed. And again, tons of evidence, scientific, clinical and experiential. And let me break that down a little bit. Scientific refers to research is done in a university laboratory, using control groups. That’s replicated multicenter studies. These are all big words, but important, double blind conditions. And then the results are reported in a peer reviewed scientific journal, and then replicated by other labs that has occurred now in two areas. First of all, that at least some mediums are highly evidential and the real deal. And that’s reported in Dr. Schwartz’s book, the afterlife experiment, and collaborated by five different universities and four institutes. And then the second area that’s been scientifically proven is that life continues after bodily death. Again, that’s been definitively demonstrated scientifically in multicenter studies now, and getting ready to be at six different universities and institutes. So there’s no question about this, too, is that at least some evidential mediums are real, and they’re really communicating with, quote, departed people, and then life continues on. Then there’s clinical evidence, which are things like near death experiences out of body experiences, shared death experiences, after death, communications etc. So, that is research done by physicians, university professors and others in clinical settings, for example, can ring a good friend of mine, Professor Emeritus University of Connecticut, Kettering PhD, he and pmh Atwater have done the most research on near death experiences anybody on the planet. And after reading reports there, there are about 10,000 documented cases of MDS and by document he means this. While they’re clinically dead, their eyes are shut, they’re not breathing or their heart beat or their brain activities stop. Their consciousness nonetheless continued to see events inside the resuscitation area, after a while got bored down the hall on top of the hospital outside the hospital, later upon successful resuscitation without any exposure to family or friends from whom they could have learned these details. These people reported great details of what happened while they’re being worked on. A doctor bent over and his pen fell out of his pocket and rolled over toward the window. I mean, how can they know this an old tennis shoe on top? And again, if they’re one of those you could discount it 10,000 doctoring assembled a team of visual experts, ophthalmologists and so on. To look at the at this question, how do you see correctly when your eyes are closed and you’re clinically dead? By the way, Brian, some of these cases have occurred and people who are blind, some of whom are blind from birth, and these optical specially said, we have no explanation for unless indeed consciousness continues after bodily death. So I would say to those people, relax, give yourself a break, take some time, buy a few books, you know, visit my website, so proof calm you 70 free articles, lots of free radio shows with Wayne Dyer and Michael Newton and Brian Weiss made the best of the best. So take time to educate yourself but because you know, what’s the saying in the Bible sikhi first, I’m getting teared up saying it. So it must be important. Seek ye first the kingdom of God and all else will be added unto you. And so yeah, do that. I mean, skip a little TV for God’s sake. So what if you don’t know the latest going on with the Kardashians? educate yourself about who you are, why you’re here who walks beside you always. And then you can really enjoy life. It changes the whole game.

Brian Smith 24:43
Yeah, to be fair to those people though. We do have this this paradigm where we worship scientists and it’s actually some people call it scientism. We have this idea that you know, it’s gotta it’s got to come from a scientist and we have most of our scientists. I think it’s fair to say how A materialistic paradigm, and it’s almost considered ignorant to believe in the afterlife. And when I’ve when I’ve approached people I can think of one sincere person came to me. She was very agnostic, you know, pretty much atheistic, but she wanted to explore now that I give her full credit because she said, I think mediumship is fake. I don’t think it’s real at all. She said, Brian, tell me the best medium, you know, and I’ll go to them and I’m going to prove it’s fake. So I gave her the name my friend, Carolyn clapper. And she had a reading with Carolyn and Carolyn made her a believer. And so you know, and I’ve had people come to me into a Brian, there’s no evidence of any of this. And I’m like, like, you send the soul proof calm. Or I tell him about Gary Schwartz. You know, and they’ll I’m like, I read the afterlife experiments, what, 20 years ago, I think it’s been now right when it first came out and I was stunned that there was actually a researcher that had taken mediums and I don’t know how many blind levels it was three or four levels of blinding. Were the medium Never met the sitter. And then the person with the medium didn’t know who the sitter was. And a sitter didn’t know who the medium was. Nobody knew anybody. And these guys were getting evidence that you know, you and I would call proof Gary would say is a strong indicator, I guess. But you and I would call proof that mediumship is real.

Mark Pitstick 26:18
Yeah. 90% success rate for these mediums versus 23% for the control group, who didn’t have a least developed mediumistic abilities. And as you say, his research was observed by a team of scientists, magicians, videographers, no one can find a flaw in the methodology of the practice. Sometimes the mediums and the sitters were in separate rooms. The mediums didn’t even hear the sitters voice, the experimenter would answer back and forth for them. So yeah, it’s there’s no question about it. Well, isn’t it like a lot of things that we pay for not being open? You know, for example, let’s say A person was brought up thinking that you should only stay with people of your own color and everybody else’s bad. Well, if they believe that they’re going to cut themselves off from a wealth of potential relationships with people of all shades, same way people of different sexual orientation, religions, culture, so people with closed minds, who don’t venture out and question for themselves and oftentimes trust their inner voice, pay for it, and that’s a form of hell, by the way. You know, hell isn’t just hell and original meanings, man, how you feel when you have your life review, and look at what you did to others and what you thought and said, Well, every day we have a life review whether we’re aware of it or not. So one of the biggest reasons to expand our mind expand our world search for good answers is to enjoy heaven now and then after we Pass on as well.

Brian Smith 28:01
Yeah. But that’s that’s an excellent point. And I think the farther I go in my life, the more I think if there’s one problem that the world has the biggest problem is that we we’ve forgotten who we are, that we think we’re a biological accident, that life has no meaning that the universe has no meaning that we were we were made conscious when we were born. And when our body stops functioning, we lose consciousness. And I think that’s at the root of every single problem that we have as human beings on this planet.

Mark Pitstick 28:33
And Einstein referred to that belief that we are separate from life and others as an optical delusion, because we depend on what we see, there’s only one little problem with that. And this is one of the things that Dr. Schwartz and I discovered when we were starting to work together I had used for years analogy from Lynne McTaggart book the field she interviewed top quantum physicists and they said that if all the light and energy, again, that’s the most absolute nature of reality, if all the light and energy in our world was the size of Mount Everest, the portion the average human can perceive, but the five senses would be the size of a golf ball. Well, Dr. Schwartz had a different metaphor. But very similar. He said, If all that exists in our world with a height of the Empire State Building, the portion the average human can proceed would be the height of a coat of paint.

Announcer 29:33
We’ll get back to grief to growth in just a few seconds. Did you know that Brian is an author and a life coach? If you’re grieving or know someone who is grieving his book, grief to growth is a best selling easy to read book that might help you or someone you know, people work with Brian as a life coach to break through barriers and live their best lives. You can find out more about Brian and what he offers at www grief to growth calm www. g ri e f the number two gr o w th calm or text growth gr o w th 231996 if you’d like to support this podcast visit slash grief to growth slash g ri f the number two gr o w th to make a financial contribution and now back to grief to growth

Mark Pitstick 30:35
so those analogies based on good science point out to people that you can’t go by I mean didn’t buy heroin lol there’s more to life than meets the eye. Yeah, people you think it’s simple, homespun phrase. And so I say most people are going around looking through a tiny pinhole and they think and they can only see the set fraction of all the reality so they think, Oh my gosh, my loved one died or oh my gosh, I have cancer I’m gonna die. God Why is her forsaken me? Oh, there’s probably no God anyway life is so, you know, we just get in this it’s all in our mind all this life is cruel and fair, random and chaotic and no, that’s true. And so that’s why it behooves people to take a little time do centering practices like meditation, yoga time and atria playing with people or pets basically whatever helps quiet the brain because the brain is the culprit. Mr. Alexander neurosurgery wrote proof of heaven and I were talking and we both agreed. He is a medical neurosurgeon. I have as a Doctor of Chiropractic, that based on our understanding of the central nervous system, 95% of what our brain does is inhibit filter out sensory input, because if we could see here, feel smell, everything exists, we’d be And then day we’d be schizophrenia we couldn’t function. And so evolutionary wise it was adaptive for us just to see and hear things we needed to survive. saber tooth tiger growing, that difference between the poisonous berries and the good berries that we could eat. Well now though it’s become a detriment in the 21st century. And so that’s why it’s wise to take some time to expand that Valve a bit. Even if you see a quarter size portion and look around more than life starts making so much more sense. And so it is a person’s earthly experience. Yeah, I

Brian Smith 32:39
remember when I first met you, it’s been three or four years ago and you were giving a lecture here in Cincinnati at the victory light. And you gave that analogy about looking to the people and and the coat of paint in the Empire State Building. I’ve thought about that ever since. And so as i’ve you know, you can look and just give some people some ideas, like for example, we can only see a small portion of that The visible of the light range of this should say visible, it’s visible to us. But like bees, for example, literally a different world than we do. Bees. When they look at a flower, they see something. And I’ve seen some photography to kind of try to try to simulate that. And it frankly looks like what people described in near death experience. It’s like they’re lit from within. So and when we think about what we can hear, I mean, we can only hear a small range of what’s going on. And dogs for example, they experience a different world than we do. So we’re so arrogant thinking that we can see and hear everything. And even with our instruments, we’re like, well, surely, with our instruments, we can see and hear all that there is, but we know that even that’s not true. We’ve got this dark matter and dark energy that we know exists because it has to exist, but we have no way of sensing it.

Mark Pitstick 33:47
Yeah, that’s science. And so for people who think there’s no science behind what we’re talking about, it’s just not true. By the way, I’d like to sidebar real quick and share with people the first time we met as Brian said he and Ty was with you. And it seemed like it was one other person with you.

Brian Smith 34:04
Yeah, we’re somebody I can remember, I think was Wendy at the time. Yeah. Okay.

Mark Pitstick 34:08
So they came to one of my talks or maybe 90 people in the room and I’m, I’m getting rain, I’m getting in the zone. Because when I have a chance to teach how to just like, say, okay, God, you know, tell me what to say how to say and when the said to reach the most number of people deeply. And so I’m walking down the aisle, looking at people and kind of reading and seeing where people are. And all of a sudden, I look over the left and there’s Brian and ty. And I’m just like, Whoa, do I know these people? I just I could feel your presence. I feel your energy and just locked eyes with you for a moment. And then you know, the rest is history. I only got in contact and been working together.

Brian Smith 34:54
It’s so wild Mark because i i’d read one of your books or I’d heard your name or something and we were about it. Nope. really who you were a detail. So we were late to the to the victory light and our friend that showed up because she was late. So we’re waiting. And I said, Oh, Mark Pittsburgh is speaking, you know, because we were going to go just walk the general floor until the next session started. That mark is speaking right now in the room down the hall. So it’s like, I want to hear him. So we walked in. And you as you said, you and I met and we’ve been working together pretty much ever since on the soul phone, helping parents heal, etc. So this is one of those things in life that was just meant to happen.

Mark Pitstick 35:29
Yeah. And I encourage people to watch for those soundings. You know, it’s important that we have kindred spirits. One of the big things I hear from people is they say that they’ve had personal experiences. Maybe they glimpse someone who, who passed on. They felt like their consciousness detached from their body for a while, but they are afraid to tell others family or friends for fear of being considered cookie. Well, first of all, there’s a very good chance that one or more of your family and friends Also had those experiences and they’re also in the closet about it can be one of the reasons were forming the greater reality living groups and I encourage people to join enlightened places like unity centers and others. So they meet kindred spirits, people are open minded, open hearted, service oriented, and then you don’t feel so alone. And that brings up a good point, we should cover the, again, based on Michael Newton’s war against mother clinical evidence, it appears that about 85% of the people on this planet right now are what are termed beginner souls. And it’s not a judgement. It’s just the state they’re at, you know, judging them would be like putting down a one year old that can’t walk at Yeah. And then another 12% or so, intermediate souls and just two or 3% advance. Well, people watching your show likely are advanced. And intermediate. And I just wrote an article, for example, number 67, or something on soul proof calm about optimal relationships for more evolved people. Because living on earth is very tricky in a number of ways for people who are partially awakened. And that’s why it’s important to have kindred spirits, to take better care of the physical plan. So your personal energy and your body and brain are more on the same wavelength, etc.

Brian Smith 37:32
That’s a really good point. You know, such as I’ve heard something similar that before because, frankly, a lot of us to people I hang out with, like yourself and other, we look around the world, like what is wrong? Why Why don’t people get this? Why are we Why are we fighting? Why aren’t we taking care of each other? isn’t as obvious that you know, we should be doing better. And that’s, I guess, a great explanation. I think we’re all I mean, thing is we know we’re constantly evolving, and we know there’s always going to be someone who’s ahead of There’s already gonna be someone who’s, you know, behind us for lack of a better way of putting it. But Earth seems to be kind of a beginner school. It just looks that way to me too. So it makes sense to me.

Mark Pitstick 38:12
Yeah, years ago, I read a channel book by Pat wrote aghast for a collective entity called Abraham, and he said, do not count. I’m getting teared up. Do not mourn. And this is paraphrasing, but do not mourn for the suffering you see on Earth. Where else would souls go to learn basic lessons? And so yeah, this is like kindergarten in the universe, but important. There’s one other thing that I encourage people to consider and I just wrote an article on this, about contrast souls. So things are not always as they seem, and this is why we just have that. Okay, whatever. You know, I’m going to look for the silver lining here, no matter what happens because there’s some good evidence and I presented some of the article that some people who appear to be ignorant, cruel, etc, are actually more evil souls who are purposely taking on out of love, a limiting outer countenance to push people’s buttons to, to trigger people to do work that they wouldn’t have otherwise if they hadn’t met this, quote, mean and bad person. Same way with people were really sick. I forget why I was reading that the report was that some higher souls, sometimes even guides will agree to come to earth with again and just part of their energy and be a really sick, invalid person. Why? So beginner souls can learn to be doctors and caregivers. So that’s you know, when you get This kind of information again, with some clinical evidence behind it. That’s when you step back and say things like, it’s all good. It’s all God. Or Dr. Schwartz and I were talking the other day about the saying, I heard from the teacher ROM das, suffering is grace. Suffering is bliss, you know, those kinds of seeming paradoxes, again, allows us to relax, do what we feel we came here to do enjoy life, and and don’t worry about it, like the Jackson Browne song, and then it’s a blink of an eye. And it truly is whether we live in 105 or five, in the span of eternity, which is forever. Yeah, that’s

Brian Smith 40:44
an interesting perspective. And I was gonna ask you, the next question is, you know, why is there suffering? But I think you you kind of you’ve already started to touch on that, you know, because people will say, Well, if there’s if there’s a God, there’s a loving, all powerful God. So why do all these these bad things happen and we label these things as bad

Mark Pitstick 41:00
Yeah, I remember when I saw the movie, oh God with john Denver and George Burns. And you know, john was asking him those questions as God. And I think I even quoted in my book soul proof. And George Burns says God was saying, I don’t create suffering, I don’t allow the suffering you do. You know, I gave you this beautiful planet and everything on it. Now it’s up to you to love one another to kill one another. So, God is not a puppet master, a dictator, a robot maker. And, and God is again, not a big guy in the sky. We’re all part of God. We’re interconnected. So that’s one reason are suffering because humans create it. Another is and Buddhists probably said the most succinctly. Why is there suffering two reasons, opportunities to grow and to serve others. Not because of life or perfect and easy all the time. Most of us wouldn’t dig deeper. Learn and when may not be motivated to then reach out and serve others just like you’ve done as a way to transcend your grieving. Yeah, I

Brian Smith 42:11
don’t know if I came up with this or not. But I had this thought experiment that I would do with myself and say, Okay, what if the world were perfect? If everything were literally perfect, every every wish I had was fulfilled the moment it happened, nothing caused me and it nothing contradicted any of my wishes. It wouldn’t be real, because there’d be nothing outside of myself. As soon as there’s anything outside of myself, it’s gonna it’s going to contradict, you know, what, what would be perfect to me. So I would be, there’d be no experience. And so I realized there has to be some level of what we call suffering or imperfection in the world for us to even experience anything. So then the question only becomes, well, what level is acceptable? So people will look and say, Well, this level is certainly unacceptable. You know, this is this is too much, but I looked at like if you look at a toddler, for example, and They fall on their skin, their knee. They think they’re dying. They literally think it’s the end of the world. Or if I, if I were to tell my daughter Shannon, you can’t have ice cream today, you can have ice cream tomorrow. You know, she would think I’m the cruelest father, ever. So what I realized is we’re basically like big toddlers. We say, Okay, this this world is it’s just too much. You know, I could see God allowing a little suffering, but not not this much. But it’s really limited, because we’re only here for a short amount of time. Yeah,

Mark Pitstick 43:27
and language is so important here. specific language because it seems to me I just finished reading a book by Bernie Siegel and his grandson, and it’s called What if everything is really perfect? Mm hmm. And it’s based on a saying by an anonymous person, that is, when you realize how perfect everything is, you’ll raise your head up and laugh at the sky. And it really is. So from the big picture standpoint, and For seeing everything, we see it perfect. But when we’re looking to even a quarter size, there are some areas that certainly don’t seem perfect. So that’s the task for the awakening person to, to take this incarnation seriously to have compassion for others to do what we can to alleviate suffering. And at the same time, remember the big picture. And it’s that’s tricky. It’s been compared as like walking on a razor’s edge.

Brian Smith 44:31
Yeah, I was talking with a client the other day and I was just talking about very, that same thing, it’s about balancing. And it’s about it’s about so when we get too far on the everything is perfect. It doesn’t matter side, because it’s all gonna be okay in the end. That makes us no earthly good. That’s not what we’re here for. But when we get too, too far down in the weeds and say, it’s terrible, I can’t stand it because it’s just it’s the worst thing ever. We’ve got to move back towards the other balance where we take that higher perspective. So being Human is a very difficult thing to do.

Mark Pitstick 45:03
It is. And, you know, we don’t have documented evidence for this. But I’ve certainly heard it said from different sources, that there’s a long waiting list among souls to come to Earth. Because it is such a intense experience. It does provide such diverse ways to grow me It’s one thing to be in a focus group in a spiritual realm. How can I work on myself? You know, it’s all hypothetical. Yeah, we come down here and the rubber hits the road. That’s when you find out how much you really know.

Brian Smith 45:34
Well, we touched on it a lot. But I want to talk about soul pro because there’s such a wealth of information there. You’ve talked about how many articles are there now about 70? Yes, so that there’s all these articles and you’ve got CDs, you’ve got experiential things that people can do. So tough to talk people through what they’ll see if they go to sell, prove calm,

Mark Pitstick 45:52
right. There’s three areas of free resources. I try to make this affordable as possible to people to do all these hours. Cause covering all the bases, you know the most of the scientific evidence that life continues after Biolay death. The clinical evidence, an article for bereaved parents when your child changes worlds when your loved one’s body is murdered, when a loved one’s physical form dies by suicide. By the way, notice some of my language that sounds cumbersome. But I never say when you die when your loved one was murdered, because you can’t die your loved one couldn’t be murdered. However your loved ones physical shell Earth suit, we call it can be so articles on just about every conceivable question, you could ask to answer the biggest questions and challenges people have during their earthly experience. Secondly, as I mentioned, lots of free radio shows I hosted a radio show twice and just gems that top, top minds and consciousness. They have For Life steadies free newsletter so those are the free. And then books, but they’re all very affordably like $15. You know, for the books, audio products, as you mentioned 12 different ones, the digital downloads 1495 I mean, yes. And what a person gets from that would cost you $250 with a therapist one on one, but it’s like having me in the room, where I take a person and the deep hypnosis, deep relaxation, and do things like past life regression, pre birth planning, identify your soul’s missions, what would your life review be like today if you died, and how can you change it so when you do pass on, it’s a work of art, etc. So there’s a explanation of each one of those products. Then I do coaching and counseling and have to charge something for that for my time. So those are all the rules. resources out there for people.

Brian Smith 48:03
That’s excellent. Yeah. And I’ve learned so much from from your books and gone through somebody’s workshops, you know, with you. You’ve given so much time to helping parents heal helping, you know, walk parents through this things. So people haven’t had that opportunity. This was a great way to get to some of Mark’s wisdom and knowledge on soul proof Comm. So we have to talk mark, we have a few minutes left, let’s talk about the soul phone. So people first of all, explain to people what it is. I’m the VP on the Borg. You’re the director of the soul phone, but let’s talk cell phone foundation. Let’s talk about what the soul phone is.

Mark Pitstick 48:37
How many minutes do we have?

Brian Smith 48:38
I’ve got about 10 minutes.

Mark Pitstick 48:40
Okay, I said to No, we got 10 or 15 minutes.

Ah, well, the soul phone project is based on research done at the laboratory for advances in consciousness and Health at the University of Arizona. Dr. Gary Schwartz I mentioned is the future Director of it. He has a team of electrical engineer, software specialist, optical physicist, evidential mediums and other experts who help him with his research. He started, we mentioned his work with evidential mediums 20 plus years ago, well, 20 years ago, he started getting tidbits of information from some of these evidential mediums, independently, they would say, carry Albert Einstein keeps coming to me and saying, You’re supposed to build technology to allow communication in between dimensions. And after several years of that, then he started working on his very first experiment in 2004. Measuring different ways to capture the signal of spirit and create even basic Yes, no binary communication with them. Well, now in 2020, we’re working what’s called the electronic soul switch, which is a binary indicator is different ways it can be done By working on now instantaneous, 99.9% reliable and accurate switch that people post material persons people in the next room can touch or influence to answer yes or no. That itself has limited usefulness. But the beauty is that this switch is small enough that can be created then in parallel with 40 other switches to create the sole keyboard, allowing texting and typing again with loved ones. And then also with post Mattel luminaries a team were told hundreds and hundreds of scientists, inventors, people who are geniuses on Earth, very dynamic people and who have learned a lot during their time in the structured universe and want to help us here on Earth. Once we have the sole keyboard, Brian, as you know, then we’re off to the races we will have a much better quantity and quality of information coming in To develop then the next two devices, so voice like a cell phone. So video, just like we’re doing now Skype zoom Facebook, the ultimate goal is to have an app applications that work with any smartphone so that people can talk with and see loved ones and also attend webinars given by these visionary luminaries. The goal for the soul video is to have a 3d holographic form. So it will be the next best thing to the person really being there because you’ll be saying solidly and match used in some Las Vegas, top clubs entertainment now and they’re quite real. So that’s the soul phone project in a nutshell, it’s happening. We appreciate funding that comes in we we have had a number of visionary donors who and almost All the team is all the team is volunteer, Dr. Schwartz and his wife Ron does not receive one penny. I’ve been working about 50 hours a week for four years, not one penny, you have a team of volunteers. So nobody’s getting rich, others nobody’s making anything but it’s a labor of love. I mean, how else could you make an impact on so many people in our world potentially as this? So we appreciate funders, we know it’s just a matter of time before we receive large funding. I mean, when I talked about $2 million dollars or something to complete the electronic soul switch, and then perhaps that again, to have a commercializable soul keyboard. So it’s really not that much money. It’s a matter of time for somebody learns it. What’s coming up is multicenter studies I mentioned earlier by the end of this year, having had the research replicated by six different universities or institutes Dr. Schwartz has third peer reviewed scientific journal describing all this and then the beginning of next year using the electronic souls which what we call seat events, which stands for cell phone

experience ethics demonstration. So, these will be public demonstrations probably virtual now, where people will see this technology working, see the results of it. Also launching during that time what are called hope sessions, which means have opportunity for post material experience to means individual clients can interact with the technology and get yes no answers from their quote departed loved ones who are standing right beside them. The there’s so much you can do with yes or no for example, you ask 20 different questions. Half advance should be no half should be yes. And the computer could show photos so you could say Is this a picture of our dog when you were little answers? Yes. Is this a picture of a birthday party we had last week? Answer should be no, because there was no birthday party. You know, did we go to Disney World for your 16th? birthday? Yes or no? Where the answer should be so at the end of 20 of those questions when they’re answered 100%, right. It’s kind of like that Demi Moore moment in the movie ghosts where she sees the penny floating in the air. And like, Oh, my God, this is really real. And then that’s that spiritually transformed experience. That awakens a person’s heart opens their mind more. And then usually they’re often running just like near death experiences, then they’re less altruistic, materialistic. They’re more loving, the more giving more peaceful etc.

Brian Smith 54:54
Yeah, one thing I want to say because as people are hearing this, I’m trying to put myself in the mind of the public. It may sound Fantastic, it may sound, you know, unbelievable. So it’s related to some people, if you’ve had signs from your loved one like, like Shannon messes with by cell phone, or if you’ve seen lights flicker in the house, or if you’ve heard of instrumental trans communications, or ebps, all these things that have been documented to be going on for years, where spirit has been interacting with just normal devices, as well, as we’ve had, like, tronics, there’s been a lot of this. So what I try to tell people imagine you build a device that’s highly sensitive, just for this purpose. And then that’s what Gary has been working on. And we’ve already got results. I mean, there’s already results that you said that are out there, but it’s coming. It’s it’s, it seems too, too good to be true. But I think it’s really coming you know, in a very short period of time.

Mark Pitstick 55:45
And it’s been a little frustrating. You know, we’ve been working on this for three years getting the word out and we’ll get emails from people say well, the cell phone ever will I be whatever really happen or is this a bunch of BS, but keep in mind, we’ve been been trying to do this on a very small budget, part time electrical engineers, part time software programmers. And so a project that could be done in a week by full time team may take months by these part time people. But one thing about Schwartz, NIH and others, we don’t give up. And we say we’ve already had the Wright brothers moment. There’s some beautiful writings by Wilbur Norvell. Right after the first flights at Kitty Hawk, you know first only lasted 18 seconds. Yeah. But they wrote, we now know that human flight is possible. There’s no doubt in their mind. Five people saw that first event. Well, we’ve already had our Wright Brothers moment. We already know that. life continues after baalei death and communication with them. I’ll be at a basic level Yes, no is possible. Now the goal is to Have a commercializable practical, usable device. And that will change the world. By the way, in our book, greater reality living, I share an interview I had with one of the mediums in which I was reportedly talking with because you have stayed propor late because we all know 100% for sure, but with Albert Einstein and Nikola Tesla, Carl Sagan, and I asked, once we have even the soul keyboard, are you all willing and able to give webinars for us on our toughest subjects, you know, global sustainability, race relations, optimal leadership, addressing hunger, overpopulation, etc. Everybody knows the list. Would you all be willing to give these webinars and the medium started laughing and she said, they’re pushing each other out of the way to get first in line. So that’s how much they’re excited to share what they know. And ganas It’s just a matter of time before we have that technology in place. So I hope this gives everyone peace, hope, things are gonna get better and things can get better right now it’s an inside job, you know, even a fraction of what we’ve been talking about.

Brian Smith 58:15
You know, as we’re talking about this, I’m thinking how as mankind, I think we’ve kind of come full circle. I listen to some teachings from Emanuel swedenborg. And he talks about there was a time in man’s history, where when people went to the spirit world, we could still see and communicate with them easily. And then as we became more and more materialistic, we started losing that ability. And I think we’re almost kind of at the Abyss now we’re at the low point where we’re so materialistic. And so maybe instead of religion, you know, being the thing that leads us back to remember where we are, maybe it’s this, that we can really, you know, fully understand who we are. So, I know there’s there’s there’s a tendency, I think, from somebody who said, Well, this is not possible. This maybe this is not meant to be are you trying to play God? You know, the veil is there for a reason. And now you might have those types of thoughts, but I think it’s something that’s really needed. Because we’re just about to destroy our planet and we’re really on the brink right now.

Mark Pitstick 59:10
But it’s, it’s not too late now, if we take action, you know, you’re talking about, there was a time swedenborg saying, My there’s still time in other cultures there aren’t so focused on. We are. My fiance, Andy works at a children’s hospital and one of our co workers is from Jamaica, and they’ve become really close and, and this woman said, Yeah, I dreamed my grandma up last night. And Andy said, Wait a minute. I you dreamed your grandma. Yeah, you know, I called her in spirit. Hmm, like, tell me more. Oh, she died a while back but I just dial her up and we have these wonderful talks and visits. So that’s part of the culture. They’re a part of the industry. Standing and yeah, that is possible. And now we’re gonna have the technology to do it for everyone, even if they’re totally closed down. I mean, if you can work a cell phone, you still work. So phone.

Brian Smith 1:00:11
Yeah. Well, that’s a good point too, because I know like Sonia Rinaldi is doing work where she’s communicating into the spirit world. And people ask me about her. And as relates his cell phone, I have a friend who’s a physical medium, he can take and talk to spirit over an Apple Watch. He’s figured out how to make apple how to talk to spirit over an Apple Watch. And they’ve actually he’s got a microphone he can talk to them on. But what I’ve realized with those their physical mediums and I that’s my belief was Sonia Rinaldi because I can’t take Sonia’s equipment and replicate it. I can’t do what she does. But with the what Gary’s working on with the soul farm project. This is independent of the operator. So it doesn’t require someone to be whatever physical medium is. They’re sitting there bringing something to it. That spirit is working through their body.

Mark Pitstick 1:00:56
Yeah, obviously, there’s been good results with Different AVP and ITC approaches, but as you say, sometimes it’s operator dependent. Sometimes results are hit and miss, you may not get anything. Some of the audio recordings are so garbled that you need a Sep script to supposedly understand what it says exactly. Likewise, visual images. The goal here is to have 99.9%, safety, accuracy, reliability, clarity, just like we’re used to now with technological devices.

Brian Smith 1:01:34
Yeah, well, I just wanna say one more thing about good as far as we are, because I was at Kitty Hawk. Last year was on vacation, I went by Kitty Hawk, and I know you and Gary always used that analogy. And seeing where they took off and seeing the museum and seeing the first you know, the first plane, and then thinking about where we are today with rockets and jets and stuff. I mean, that’s kind of where we are with the cell phone. More than that first flight, we’re past that even, but you know, it’ll, it’ll develop Over time, and it’ll become, you know, it’s gonna become ubiquitous, I think at some point in time.

Mark Pitstick 1:02:05
Yep. And I hope people are inspired by these analogies and begin flying themselves. We each are special souls, special beings who came here with gifts. Again, it sits in Native American teaching, as each one of us has a giveaway. And I’ve seen it for many years as in life is like a puzzle. And when we each contribute our part, do what we came here to do. The pieces of the puzzle come together, and we can have heaven on earth.

Brian Smith 1:02:36
Yeah, absolutely. Well, uh, Mark, I could talk to you all day. We set we go about an hour, so we’re at an hour now. I really appreciate you doing this has been great catching up with you.

Mark Pitstick 1:02:45
It’s an honor to be on here. Thanks for all you’re doing Brian.

Brian Smith 1:02:47
Anything you want to say in closing?

Mark Pitstick 1:02:51
Just the website again. So for more information to learn more about the soul phone, soul phone dot org. So URL and learn about it share about with others. Take it, take it within internalize that we’ve mapped out how to do that. And enjoy your life. I look forward to seeing you someday somewhere. Yeah.

Brian Smith 1:03:18
Thanks, Mark. You have a good weekend.

Mark Pitstick 1:03:20
All right, you too, my fan. But

Brian Smith 1:03:23
well, I hope you enjoyed the episode. I want to make it really easy for you to reach me. So just send me a text 231996 and simply text the word growth gr o w th. In fact you can right now just say hey Siri, send the message. 231996 and when Siri asks you what you want to send, just say growth. You can do the same thing with Ok, Google. Thanks a lot. Have a wonderful day.

Announcer 1:03:50
Thanks for listening to grief to growth. Brian hopes that you find this episode helpful. And we’ll come back for future episodes. Brian’s best selling book grief together planted not buried is a great resource for anyone who is coping with grief or know someone who is. If you enjoy the podcast and would like to support it, there are three things you can do to help. The first is to share the podcast with someone that you think it will help. The second is to go to iTunes rate and review the episode. The third way you can support the podcast is by becoming a patron. Head over to slash grief to growth. That’s pa t ar e o Slash grief, the number two growth and sign up to make a small monthly donation. patrons get access to exclusive bonus content and knowledge that you are helping to spread the message of grief to grow. For more about Brian and grief to growth, visit www grief to

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